2020 elections and current politics

A place to discuss religious, political and any other serious issues. Those who are easily offended are asked to steer clear.

Moderator: The Slider

User avatar
Sephiroth9611
Posts: 155
Location: Off-world colonies

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#21 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 3:58 pm

DeathScythe wrote:Wherever Trump wants to withdraw from, and Venezuela. I hate this party.

That makes sense. Socialist paradise on the one hand, but RUSSIA! on the other.

I was born in 1986, so I am an "older millenial", although not the oldest possible millenial.

1981 here. Right in the sweet spot of the Cusp. Gen X/Millennial/Xennial. I actually prefer Gen Y for a label as I never associated myself with the turn of the millennium.

I live with a Gen Z dude, my partner's bother. Born in 98. He's a factory worker, likes video games and pro wrestling. Zero interest in politics. Not unlike other millenials I know.

Does he save? Have any goals? Or is it all day by day?

I'm a team lead and interact with multiple Gen Z people, but I can't gauge the differences between us really because of human nature. Meaning, I focus on similarities, and talk about shared interests, like gaming or Linux.

I'd say the primary generational differences are pop culture. So I don't talk to them about it. Yes, those college campus YouTube videos ("SJW owned") make you think they're lunatics. But that is a very specific type of young person, and not the type you encounter in the working world.

Do you find that Millennials or Gen Z'ers in the workplace operate with a sense of entitlement? Do they need to be coddled?

I must say I would take Tulsi over Bernie now, but I accept her best bet is for VP. She's the only candidate who has stood up for Assange.

I can understand why folks are so in love with Bernie, having seen the same thing with the Ron-ulans on the GOP side back in the day, an insurgent force running against the mainstream. Bernie has made it where Ron never did, the mainstream.

I can see the thought of a reset being necessary, for Rome to come more into line with your thinking. I think I would just think of my beliefs as a seperate "denomination" of Catholic until that occured. But, I would want it to occur.

Schism is a very big deal. Trads are very aware of it and the warnings down through history to avoid it if at all possible. One reason why Catholics in general give for why the Catholic Church is the True Church, it has maintained its unity down through the centuries while others have split off and then fractured. The SSPX group I have mentioned is constantly attacked by the mainstream as being in schism, but it is relentless in its assertion that it is "in union" with Rome, it's just a matter of disagreement. If it comes down to a parting of ways, it will be the apocalyptic event people have been waiting for.

Good to know you're aware of it. It's pretty common here, in the land of mega-churches and associates television. I agree with you about the Christian communities.

Do you ever see on TV those commercials for orgs of Christian/Jewish Fellowship that are soliciting donations for relief of poor Jews in Israel? Not something that one sees for Christians in Iraq. :(

Probably bad, considering the suicide rate of post-operation Trans people, and our private healthcare system that is more than happy to take that money.

There are key differences in the LGBT community (I am gay, did I say that?) regarding the concept of "trans kids" and pre-puberty hormone blockers, and whether that's okay. It's not, IMO, and should be an affront to gay men. How many of us, especially if we had far-left parents, would have been "transitioned" as children, based on our pecuiliarities? Same thing applies to teens and other minors transitioning. It's an adult decision.

Some gay pride parades have eliminated drag, because it's offensive to Trans people. There's about to be a throwdown I think, in the LGBT community. Don't get excited though: PC culture will prevail and gay men will be called the privileged group. This already occurs.

I don't think you've said that before, no. I've read a few things about the divide in the LGBT community over trans issues. Sucks to be the "middle class white man" of the community, huh?

[A]s UBI-only Americans become the majority versus working Americans, something I think is inevitable.

You think this is inevitable? "Each according his ability to each according to his need?" How will that work out long term?
Since October 3rd, 2000 | "Quite a thing to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave."

User avatar
SOLDIERofficer81
Posts: 162
Location: 7th Heaven
Contact:

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#22 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 6:15 am

Without the pollution I see no problem with the use of fossil fuels, outside of them being non-renewable and therefore short-term.

This solution also enables the pollution to get into the atmosphere in the first place, and while we might be sucking it out later, are there still consequences from that? How is that ultimately better than developing electric cars and trucks to where they can be used more functionally?

Regardless, the thing is still good because we should still repair the damage we've done. This is like the cotton gin prolonging American slavery. Yes, it absolutely did do that, but do we think it would have been better to not invent it at all? I would think not.

I don't have a problem with electric cars, renewable energy, and the like. But I am mistrustful of the global warming crowd. It seems like a lot of them are either ideologically motivated (end fossil fuels now and the consequences be damned) or simply have the desire to be victorious in the global warming debate, full stop.
Last edited by SOLDIERofficer81 on Sat Apr 13, 2019 6:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
"Let us never miss a step. May we never lose our friends. This is our home, our haven, our Citadel."
Citadel denizen since October 5, 2000 | SOLDIER's Final Fantasy VII Messageboard

User avatar
Sephiroth9611
Posts: 155
Location: Off-world colonies

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#23 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 3:13 pm

This is an interesting article about Warren. She was a Republican up until 1996.
Since October 3rd, 2000 | "Quite a thing to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave."

User avatar
DeathScythe
Libertarian Socialist
Posts: 47
Location: Texas

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#24 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 4:28 am

Does he save? Have any goals? Or is it all day by day?


Day by day. But I feel like that applies to me too, and unskilled labor in general.

Do you find that Millennials or Gen Z'ers in the workplace operate with a sense of entitlement? Do they need to be coddled?


My workplace got on board with the SJW movement a while ago. We now have multiple interest groups, one for black associates, one for LGBT associates, one for women, one for the disabled, one for latinos, etc. Most aren't very popular.

So they're already catered to, basically. And everyone is different. My people are all cool for the most part. Generally, it's the older associates who are the most challenging for leadership, either because they don't like the language someone, usually younger, is using, or how they are dressed, or mundane things like to "Can we move the desk a few inches this way or that", "Can we have maintenance replace that one light bulb that's out, I feel like it is hard to see."

I can understand why folks are so in love with Bernie, having seen the same thing with the Ron-ulans on the GOP side back in the day, an insurgent force running against the mainstream. Bernie has made it where Ron never did, the mainstream.


He has name recognition this time, but I would say his brand of politics becoming the new Democratic mainstream is just a possibility for now. We shall see! There are still those that would prefer a new party because they don't see it as a possibility at all.

Schism is a very big deal. Trads are very aware of it and the warnings down through history to avoid it if at all possible. One reason why Catholics in general give for why the Catholic Church is the True Church, it has maintained its unity down through the centuries while others have split off and then fractured. The SSPX group I have mentioned is constantly attacked by the mainstream as being in schism, but it is relentless in its assertion that it is "in union" with Rome, it's just a matter of disagreement. If it comes down to a parting of ways, it will be the apocalyptic event people have been waiting for.


That's an interesting dichotomy. The alternative thinkers must make the case that they're not that alternative.

Do you ever see on TV those commercials for orgs of Christian/Jewish Fellowship that are soliciting donations for relief of poor Jews in Israel? Not something that one sees for Christians in Iraq. :(


Indeed, I live with an evangelist and get Christians United for Israel pamphlets and letters delivered all the time. And no, you don't see it for the eastern Christians. That's a good point actually.

I don't think you've said that before, no. I've read a few things about the divide in the LGBT community over trans issues. Sucks to be the "middle class white man" of the community, huh?


You are reading the situation correctly, LOL.

You think this is inevitable? "Each according his ability to each according to his need?" How will that work out long term?


I think it's inevitable that the amount of individuals we need to give according to their ability becomes less and less over time as automation increases, and as a society we will need to address how we will continue to function in a post-work world.

At the same time, I anticipate a percentage of the current labor force to still be necessary, and so they must still be incentivized to be that quarter of the population we need working. Thus, UBI for all, working or not, and the workers get extra.

However, I don't intend that 75% of the country no longer in the workforce to just roll over and die, or watch TV all day. I expect to see an explosion in all of the arts: music, sculpting, painting. Some of which can turn into careers, as they generate products that can be sold. And an explosion in community service, including spiritual-based volunteerism. Everyone who is not doing what they really want to because they have to pay bills and provide for families, will now be able to experiment.

How many people have some business idea that they can't risk leaving their job to try and advance? And what does UBI mean for those would-be entrepreneurs? Or would-be inventors that just don't have the time to build prototypes, etc.?

I think it's exciting. And like Yang says, if you really think it's inevitable, there's no reason to not be early, since being late is the collapse of society.

I don't have a problem with electric cars, renewable energy, and the like. But I am mistrustful of the global warming crowd. It seems like a lot of them are either ideologically motivated (end fossil fuels now and the consequences be damned) or simply have the desire to be victorious in the global warming debate, full stop.


Do you believe in global warming being caused by human activity, or no? And do you think transitioning away from fossil fuels is a good thing for society, in general?

And of course it is ideologically motivated. Almost everything is. x_x

User avatar
DeathScythe
Libertarian Socialist
Posts: 47
Location: Texas

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#25 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:20 am

Also, Seph, Andrew Yang did an interview with Ben Shapiro last weekend that you might find more interesting than the Rogan one. I felt when watching it that Ben asked questions you would ask.

https://youtu.be/-DHuRTvzMFw

I'm curious as to your thoughts on this new generation of Buckleys. Shapiro, Milo Yiannopolis, Jordan Peterson, Gavin McInnes, hell, Stephen Crowder...etc. As well as what's happened to the old influencers on the right, O'Reilly, Limbaugh, etc.
Last edited by DeathScythe on Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
SOLDIERofficer81
Posts: 162
Location: 7th Heaven
Contact:

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#26 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 7:25 pm

Do you believe in global warming being caused by human activity, or no? And do you think transitioning away from fossil fuels is a good thing for society, in general?

I don't know if I believe in man-made global warming or not. And what difference does it make. I'm old remember times when global warming was spoken of in the context of warmer weather at higher latitudes and longer growing seasons, not doom and gloom runaway greenhouse effect. Let's decide if global warming is or is not happening and decide if a course of action is necessary. Wanting to assign blame for global warming just gets back to the anti-fossil fuels agenda.

Back in high school, renewable energy was a topic one year. One of the pieces of evidence we used was quote saying that even if humanity stopped all emissions immediately, temperatures would continue to rise. That's always stuck with me and I should really dig into my stuff and find that quote.
"Let us never miss a step. May we never lose our friends. This is our home, our haven, our Citadel."
Citadel denizen since October 5, 2000 | SOLDIER's Final Fantasy VII Messageboard

User avatar
Sephiroth9611
Posts: 155
Location: Off-world colonies

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#27 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:24 pm

Deathscythe, what is the origin of your avatar?
Since October 3rd, 2000 | "Quite a thing to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave."

User avatar
Sephiroth9611
Posts: 155
Location: Off-world colonies

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#28 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:01 pm

DeathScythe wrote:I'm curious as to your thoughts on this new generation of Buckleys. Shapiro, Milo Yiannopolis, Jordan Peterson, Gavin McInnes, hell, Stephen Crowder...etc. As well as what's happened to the old influencers on the right, O'Reilly, Limbaugh, etc.

I don't know a lot about these guys. Most of them have become prominent through new media, something I don't have much access to being deaf. Podcasts, videos with little or no closed captioning... I miss Web 1.0.

Buckley's successors at National Review are all neocons. I had a subscription gifted to me once, but I didn't keep it up. Rush I still respect. He was wishy washy on Trump, but he still from what I read occasionally is on the ball on various issues. I never watched O'Reilly or Beck when he was on Fox. Bill was to me unwatchable and Beck was on during the day when i had other things to do.

that vid from Shapiro looks interesting. I'll watch it when I have a chance.
Since October 3rd, 2000 | "Quite a thing to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave."

User avatar
SOLDIERofficer81
Posts: 162
Location: 7th Heaven
Contact:

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#29 » Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:18 am

"Far too long we have lived with the discomfort of being a second-class citizen, and frankly, I'm tired of it, and every single Muslim in this country should be tired of it," Omar said at the event. "CAIR was founded after 9/11 because they recognized that some people did something and that all of us were starting to lose access to our civil liberties."

It sure doesn't look like her words are being taken out of context. It looks like she's downplaying 9/11, especially considering her audience and the subject of her remarks.
"Let us never miss a step. May we never lose our friends. This is our home, our haven, our Citadel."
Citadel denizen since October 5, 2000 | SOLDIER's Final Fantasy VII Messageboard

User avatar
DeathScythe
Libertarian Socialist
Posts: 47
Location: Texas

Re: 2020 elections and current politics

Post#30 » Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:19 pm

I don't know if I believe in man-made global warming or not. And what difference does it make. I'm old remember times when global warming was spoken of in the context of warmer weather at higher latitudes and longer growing seasons, not doom and gloom runaway greenhouse effect. Let's decide if global warming is or is not happening and decide if a course of action is necessary. Wanting to assign blame for global warming just gets back to the anti-fossil fuels agenda.

Back in high school, renewable energy was a topic one year. One of the pieces of evidence we used was quote saying that even if humanity stopped all emissions immediately, temperatures would continue to rise. That's always stuck with me and I should really dig into my stuff and find that quote.


I don't know enough regarding the science to convince you.

Now, a while back I checked this map: https://bit.ly/2KIM3Hz, to confirm that my part of Texas would be safe and sound should the ice caps melt. It is. And so I rest easier.

One thing I like to remind everyone during the global warming debate, is that there are other reasons not to pollute besides global warming. Such as: having clean air, water, and soil, as that relates to wildlife and agriculture, but also human health. Motor vehicles emit a plethora of gases and particles that lead to respiratory problems, acid rain, etc. There are also spills. Some of these issues are harder to dispute than the affect of carbon dioxide and other gasses on global warming.

I like electric cars for now, because ultimately, they're powered by the grid. We can power the grid through multiple methods. We can use fossil fuels for as long as necessary, but can easily transition when possible. Cars are about 1/5th of our emissions in total.

Deathscythe, what is the origin of your avatar?


See, I thought this was obvious, but it's a sickle and hammer super-imposed with an anarchist "A" symbol. Also the whole thing is red and black which are colors typically associated with anarchic symbolism.

I typically take it to represent anarcho-communism or anarcho-syndicalism, but it represents libertarian socialism just fine too, and it's provocative. All of these ideologies fall under the left-libertarian umbrella.

I don't know a lot about these guys. Most of them have become prominent through new media, something I don't have much access to being deaf. Podcasts, videos with little or no closed captioning... I miss Web 1.0.

Buckley's successors at National Review are all neocons. I had a subscription gifted to me once, but I didn't keep it up. Rush I still respect. He was wishy washy on Trump, but he still from what I read occasionally is on the ball on various issues. I never watched O'Reilly or Beck when he was on Fox. Bill was to me unwatchable and Beck was on during the day when i had other things to do.

that vid from Shapiro looks interesting. I'll watch it when I have a chance.


I didn't know you were deaf! How has that never come up? I can see how that would make modern web difficult. I've recently been trying to learn basic signs to talk to a deaf associate I work with, so we don't have to use the note cards all the time. It's pretty cool, but doesn't translate to Rosetta Stone format unfortunately.

I always thought you to be a Bill O' fan, so I'm surprised, and impressed again with your inability to be cookie-cut.

I didn't think about Buckley's successors at National Review really, by Buckleys I meant, the popular intelligentsia of the right.

I sort of like the new crop. Some are clowns, but I like Shapiro and Jordan Peterson because they can debate, although I acknowledge flaws I think I see in their logic (usually religion with those two). With Milo, I liked the idea of a prominent gay conservative in popular media, but I'm pretty sure it was a character. I also think Ann Coulter is a character. He went too far, anyway, and probably would have ultimately made us look worse.

Any thoughts on Alex Jones?

"Far too long we have lived with the discomfort of being a second-class citizen, and frankly, I'm tired of it, and every single Muslim in this country should be tired of it," Omar said at the event. "CAIR was founded after 9/11 because they recognized that some people did something and that all of us were starting to lose access to our civil liberties."

It sure doesn't look like her words are being taken out of context. It looks like she's downplaying 9/11, especially considering her audience and the subject of her remarks.


I interpreted "some people did something" to be referring to the passage of the Patriot Act, considering the following context.

Has she clarified? I don't really follow her, and didn't know who she was until her supporters snapped at Chelsea Clinton.
Last edited by DeathScythe on Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Return to “Serious Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron