Human Life vs Human Freedom

[SOLDIERofficer81]

Gun to your head, you have to chose one or the other, and your decision will guide humanity for countless generations to come, which is paramount, human life or human freedom?

Some context. Another mass shooting has brought gun control to the fore. Gun control is just one front in the culture wars. And as far as I can tell, the culture wars boil down to a conflict between life and freedom. Because you can't guarantee human life without sacrificing freedom and you can't guarantee human freedom without sacrificing lives.

[The Slider]

Why do you need a gun to be free?

[SOLDIERofficer81]

I believe owning a gun is a natural right, universal and inalienable. To take that right away would be to infringe on my freedom.

Check this out if you're interested.

[DeathScythe]

I think freedom is paramount, and I am pro gun rights. I think the government is fully capable of corrupting and it's necessary for now. I also feel gun ownership is mandatory in many rural parts of the country. If you don't live somewhere where a police car shows up almost instantly after being called, a gun is a good thing to have.

One wonders though how you would apply the framing of this moral argument (human freedom vs. human life) to the abortion issue?

[Sephiroth9611]

One wonders though how you would apply the framing of this moral argument (human freedom vs. human life) to the abortion issue?

That's obviously going to come down to if one thinks the fetus is a separate being with rights of its own or not.

[DeathScythe]

Hi Seph,

Well, if you're framing gun ownership as an issue of human freedom over human lives, you're acknowledging the argument made that legalized firearms leads to more mass shootings, gun crime, etc., than in countries where it's more heavily regulated.

In that argument, the supposed victims of legal firearms are generally all post-birth, full human souls, by anyone's measure. Of course, fetal deaths from guns can still occur as well.

In the case of a human fetus being killed through the process of abortion (for whatever reason), it's either less morally offensive than an adult or child victim dying of gun crime, or it is exactly the same. That depends on the answer to your question.

I would think that when contemplating choosing freedom or human lives regarding guns, you should apply the same reasoning to that issue as well. Unless you believe that fetuses are even more important that born people.

[Sephiroth9611]

Hey.

I'm just thinking this out, so don't take any of this as hard and fast.

With firearms, there certainly is a level of trust involved. By fully recognizing the right to arms, society is trusting that those who choose to bear arms are going to use them responsibly and not hurt those who choose not to bear arms.

There is that Heinlein quote that a well armed society is a polite society.

I am reminded of the scene in Unforgiven when Clint Eastwood shoots the saloon keeper and Gene Hackman calls Clint out for shooting an unarmed man. Clint replies, "If he is going to decorate his saloon with my friend, he should have armed himself."